Some people are jerks, but you never knew it ;-(

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 5:49 am

Greetings all

So you spend three years of your life, and much of your spare time, to try to do something for people you cared about, and who you thought cared about you. You spend a thousand hours and more money than you could have spent to provide the best because you felt they deserved that. Because cheap is just that, cheap. All you ever wanted in return for this was the company of those friends. You did what you thought was right. You did the best you could.

So what do you see today? Most of those "friends" are posting at the board that another of those "friends" started because of one poster. That's right, just one poster. This "friend" keeps saying how cheap it is and how certain things will never happen and talks of things he will never do. Well lets just call it like it is, he's turned out to be a real jerk. And much less intelligent than I thought he was. Yes anyone can throw a message board up at a cheap site. And it's easy to steal members from other sites and then say how great you are. But so much more has gone into this place than he will ever know. And he'll never be able to add anything close to that because it takes character. A quality it's plain to see that this man does not possess.

He's a jerk because he knows how much time and effort I've put into this and instead of working with us to solve any problems he steals many of our best contributors and then boasts how "great" he's doing. What a joke.

Where does he think all his "loyal" members came from? LOL!

His mental capacity is obviously impaired because the words "will never happen" and "I'll never do this or that" do not apply to running a message board, or to life for that matter.

As for all of my other "friends" posting over there, they seem to have forgotten the past three years. And some of them the past ten!

Ah well, spilt milk I guess. I hope they enjoy themselves because they have abandoned a true friend. And those are hard to find. To those of you (and you know who you are) who have stuck around and remained loyal to our dream you will always be special to me. I'll do my best to keep things going for you folks. At least I know the last few years where not a complete waste of time eh?

And also that there are still good people in this world.

Anyway, what's his face has been running his mouth uncontested for weeks and I just felt like venting a bit. I feel better now.

hocus2004 · Post by **hocus2004** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 6:36 am

"Most of those "friends" are posting at the board that another of those "friends" started because of one poster. That's right, just one poster."

I sympathize with the emotions being expressed in your post, ES. I feel a need to amplify the record a bit on this one particular comment.

There is a sense in which what you are saying here is so. We lost most of our posters to the raddr board because you reinstated my posting privileges here. In a surface sense, that is indeed what happened.

The realites are a lot more complex, however. The reality is that I am just a person carrying a message. All that I have done is to report what the historical data says. It is really the historical data that people are angry at, not me. Raddr's recent comment at the Early Retirement Forum that JWR1945 is also banned for life from his site shows this to be so. Raddr has not expressly said that William Bernstein is banned, but I think it is fair to say that that logically follows.

The way that I have tried to make sense of this is to divide the issue into two parts: (1) The Debate About Having a Debate, which is all the trickery that has been employed to block reasoned discussions; and (2) The Great SWR Debate, which is the substance stuff.

This site is now the only site which permits honest and informed posting on SWRs. I think that makes us special. We are very, very small, but very, very special. My hope is that in time we will be able to build on the thing that makes us stand out in a significant way from all the boards that have more posters than we do.

I don't think that the time is right for us to discuss in detail the things that can be done for us to attract more posters to this place. But I don't think it is a bad idea to put the thought before people that the same earth-shaking substance stuff that caused our old posters to leave us can be put to use in future days bringing new ones to us.

It's worth noting that, in the early days of the SWR discussions, there were scores of posters at the Motley Fool board who said that they found the idea of the Data-Based SWR to be the most exciting one that had ever been brought before that board community. If lots of people at that board thought it, there are lots of people in the outside world who would think it if the chance to participate in reasoned discussions re the issues were put before them.

As small as we are when our size is measured by the number of posters who post here today, we are just that big when you measure instead by the power of the insights presented on an almost daily basis in JWR1945's research. There is more useful stuff on how to put together an effective Retire Early plan being presented at this board than there are at other boards with ten times as many posts.

Springstein wrote a song about the phenomenon--"From Small Things, Mama, Big Things One Day Come."

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 7:04 am

Greetings hocus :)

I don't think that the time is right for us to discuss in detail the things that can be done for us to attract more posters to this place

Well guess what? We are here. If folks want to post here they are welcome too. I'll continue to post my stuff. You'll continue to post your stuff. Those who don't like it have other options. Simple. I like simple

mickeyd · Post by **mickeyd** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 8:32 am

ES,

I read your initial post twice, trying to understand it. I read Hocus reply and your reply to him. I'm still lost.

I have no idea who/what you are refering to when you use "friend" or "friends" .

There is obviously some past history that I am not privy to.

From what I can surmise, there is another site out there that many (most?) of the posters to this list went to when Hocus came to your site. These "friends" are now posting to this other site and not posting here.

I've only been here for several months so I must have missed some kind of controversy prior to me locating this forum.

Without advertising the other site, can I ask that you clerify what is going on. I'm sure that there are others who visit this forum on a regular basis that are also as stumped as I am.

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 8:55 am

Greetings mickeyd :)

Without advertising the other site, can I ask that you clerify what is going on. I'm sure that there are others who visit this forum on a regular basis that are also as stumped as I am.

Sure. The "friends" I speak of I've know for many years. Some of them are the reason I built this site in the first place. So we would all have a place to post for free and stay together. All this goes back to when we where all at TMF.

I apologize to those that have no idea what I was talking about and they should just ignore the post. I guess that post was meant for those that do know. I should have been clear about that but I didn't think of it at the time. Sorry for any confusion.

kathyet · Post by **kathyet** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:00 am

ES,

I follow both sites and I didn't think any one stopped posting here except maybe a few. I also think you have worked very hard and done a great job with this site and I can understand your sentiments and need to vent.

Keep up the good work.

Kathyet

mickeyd · Post by **mickeyd** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:02 am

kathyet · Post by **kathyet** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:07 am

Mickeyed

The Motely Fool, Everyone posted there. That is how I found all of guys to begin with and have learned alot from them all.

Kathyet

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:17 am

Greetings Kathyet :)

I also think you have worked very hard and done a great job with this site and I can understand your sentiments and need to vent.

Thanks Kathyet. Sometimes you just have to get junk off your chest.

Are you wearing your seat belt today?

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:19 am

Greetings mickeyd :)

TMF?

Oh no I did it again!

Thanks Kathyet!

kathyet · Post by **kathyet** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:25 am

No I am not I need one when I am on my computer too now?????

BTW my DH put a radar detector in my car the next day so I am prepared.....

Kathyet

Post by **ElSupremo** » Fri Jul 30, 2004 9:46 am

Greetings Kathyet :)

They really do save lives. This is well documented. I am here today because my girlfriend in high school made me wear mine one day. We were hit by a drunk driver head on minutes after we left home. No one in either car was killed thank heavens. All six occupants in both cars (Including the drunk guy) were wearing seat belts.

Do me a personal favor, try to wear yours please. I'd rather have you scrunched than crunched.

ben · Post by **ben** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 2:50 am

Hi ES

; I will keep posting on all 3-4 boards (as long as my fool.com subscription lasts) - some of my friends are here at NFB, some at
raddr-pages - and most still on both boards. Cheers!

ataloss · Post by **ataloss** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 4:09 am

I agree with Ben, I'll be posting here and there. The problem I see with posting here is the hijacking (and attempted hijacking) of threads by hocus and jwr. To post here, you need to do what everyone in this thread has done and ignore the hocus post. It is sort of interesting to see him look for common ground with ES (both being persecuted because of the site's openness to data-based swr.) I recall when he was reminding wanderer of their bond- both perceived that they were mistreated by intercst.

This site is now the only site which permits honest and informed posting on SWRs. I think that makes us special. We are very, very small, but very, very special.

I don't think that this board is as small as that, but this is one of the more minor distortions and misconceptions in that post

Even Th who came as a new poster and a defender of diversity and opponent of banning posters got fed up with hocus and left. Unfortunate as he was in the top 20 of active posters.

I am not particularly interested in posting anything here about withdrawal rates or early retirement since a serious discussion isn't possible in the presence of the trolls. On other topics one has to choose since the comments here (mental deficiency and so forth) seem to be further polarizing and some people will post only at one site or the other.

Bookm · Post by **Bookm** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 4:36 am

Greetings ataloss:

I am not particularly interested in posting anything here about withdrawal rates or early retirement since a serious discussion isn't possible in the presence of the trolls

There are plenty of other topics to discuss. I'd bet I couldn't even count on one hand my posts dealing with that subject matter. I don't discuss those topics either, but I still find plenty to talk about. Especially things not having to do with those I don't like.

Bookm

hocus2004 · Post by **hocus2004** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 5:34 am

"The problem I see with posting here is the hijacking (and attempted hijacking) of threads by hocus and jwr."

This personal attack post is in violation of the rules that govern posting at this site. Posters who participate at this site have a right to expect that the site rules will be administered in reasonable ways. This poster has a long history of abusive posting. He should be given a warning that his posting privileges will be revoked if he continues to post in violation of the site rules.

kathyet · Post by **kathyet** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:07 am

I think most of us on this board are fully aware of what has caused problems on this board, and I know I am fully aware of what is or isn't a violation on this board just because you or I may not agree with what some else says doesn't mean we have to right to belittle, hinder, or stop someone from saying what they think. This was supposed to be a board of free exchange of thinking ideas the key word free.

As far as I am concerned "Talk To The Hand"

Kathyet

Post by **ElSupremo** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:19 am

Greetings Kathyet :)

This was supposed to be a board of free exchange of thinking ideas the key word free.

Quite right. And I plan on giving everyone an equal chance to express those opinions. Sticks and stones.

Post by **ElSupremo** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:26 am

Greetings ataloss :)

On other topics one has to choose since the comments here (mental deficiency and so forth) seem to be further polarizing and some people will post only at one site or the other.

Polarize?

Well then I've have just begun to polarize!

I'm tired of walking around here trying not to step on toes. The people that want to post here are always welcome. If they don't want to it's better for them and us that they post elsewhere.

Hey! I've got a system!

hocus2004 · Post by **hocus2004** » Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:42 am

"This was supposed to be a board of free exchange of thinking ideas, the key word free."

All posters agree to follow the site rules when they first sign up here. By taking that pledge to follow the site rules, all posters who participate here have given up the "right" to engage in posting practices in violation of the site rules.